Episode 119: Is MSG Safe? w/ Cara Harbstreet
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Episode Description
In this episode of The Up-Beet Dietitians podcast, Emily and Hannah are joined by previous guest, Cara Harbstreet. This episode, Cara breaks down the misconceptions around MSG and where this bias comes from. Cara discusses sources of MSG, specifically the naturally-occuring sources you may not know about. She also provides advice on how to introduce MSG into your at-home cooking if you so desire. Tune in for a great episode!
Cara is based in Kansas City and works in private practice and nutrition communications. She's a former athlete and still enjoys running, lifting, and outdoor activities whenever she gets the chance. Her work focuses on non-diet messaging, which is often featured in national media outlets and through brand partnerships. She also works 1:1 with clients for intuitive eating, eating disorder recovery, and sports nutrition.
Cara Harbstreet
Website: www.streetsmartnutrition.com
IG, TikTok, Twitter: @streetsmart.rd
Books: Healthy Eating for Life, an Intuitive Eating Workbook to Help You Stop Dieting Forever
More links:
Tune in on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or YouTube to listen.
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hello guys welcome to a brand new episode of the upbeat DS podcast we have
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a returning guest today we are joined by Cara harp Street we had her on episode 54 so major throwback there we talked
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about way back then um intuitive eating and Sports Nutrition and today we are completely kind of doing a 180 I would
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say and talking about MSG um we would consider Cara the CEO of MSG if you
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follow her on social media you'd likely agree um so we are getting into that today with her and just to give you a
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quick refresher of who carara is Cara's based in Kansas City and works in private practice and nutrition
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Communications she's a former athlete and still enjoys running lifting and outdoor activities whenever she gets a
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chance her work focuses on non-diet messaging which is often featured in
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National media outlets and through brand Partnerships she also works one-on-one with clients for intuitive eating eating
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disorder R eating disorder recovery and Sports Nutrition we're so excited for
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this episode and we can't wait for you to listen enjoy Cara welcome back to the upbe
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digestions podcast hello thanks for having me back we are so excited to have you back we
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are going into MSG today which Emily and I have kind of coined you as the CEO of
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MSG so we know you'll have some great info for us but remind our listeners who
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either haven't heard you before on the podcast or are brand new here A Day in the Life for you what you do for work
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Hobbies all that good stuff well a uh significant portion of my work now is
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content creation on social media which is where you'll find me talking about MSG literally all the time but outside
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of that I am still working as a dietitian so very limited private practice at this point day-to-day is
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always really really different but for the most part you'll find me either in the kitchen working on recipe
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development or video content I do a lot of copywriting both for my own blog in
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my own platforms as well as on behalf of clients um and we're about to head into a travel season so my day-to-day is
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about to get even more irregular we'll say you know traveling for conferences and other
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events like that so I'm definitely not a creature of habit when it comes to a daily routine but it's all really
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exciting and it all has everything to do with delicious food which is awesome and you can't I feel like it's tough to get
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sick when sick of delicious food which is good yes I mean that's probably one
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of the I guess hidden benefits like yes I do have to clean the kitchen multiple times any day that I'm cooking but the
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payoff is meal prep gets done and we have many many things to munch on
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can't complain well we are so happy you are doing well and we have you back on
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so let's jump right into it and talk about MSG and first and foremost we just
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have to kind of get it out of the way because people might have heard about MSG I'm sure they've heard rumors about
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MSG but just to start us off what exactly is
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MSG good question and I agree super important to start with because we hear that acronym MSG and it never fails
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whenever I post about this someone chimes in and they're like oh Madison Square Gardens and it's like no no no
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we're talking about monosodium glutamate so that's what the MSG is referring to
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and it's a rather simple molecular structure especially when we consider you know how big and complex you know
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big relatively speaking other molecules in the body or our food can be so that mono sodium refers to suggest a single
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sodium molecule and then the glutamate refers to the amino acid glutamate so when that single sodium hooks up with
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that glutamate molecule all of a sudden boom we have our MSG but despite the
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relative Simplicity of what that molecular structure is it actually contributes a lot of flavor so you might
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hear it referred to as Umami you know that's what it's originally known for that's a very Savory flavor one of the
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five basic tastes that our tongues are able to to detect and pick up on and in food it's both naturally occurring or
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can be added through either processing or cooking so there's a number of ways that we actually get it in our diet but
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the you know very very short inversion of what it is it's just that single sodium attached to a glutamate I feel
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like I'm glad you defined it as that because I feel like it's like almost
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like we're probably jumping a little bit ahead but like perceived as this very scary
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complex thing that is just going around um yeah
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I think it really goes back to that recommendation you know the very like diety thought of oh well if you can't
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pronounce it it should be avoided or it's unsafe it's unhealthy that
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perception when we start getting into like very scientific um labels or names
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for these different molecules I admit like it is intimidating if you don't have that scientific background or you
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know it's been a while since you've taken a chemistry course which I think for most people is true you know it
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really does get a little bit intimidating and then of course you know there's all this debate about ingredients in general food can be a
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very loaded topic but I tell people you know if you're imagining some kind of
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you know toxic poisonous powder like that idea is is really outdated and when
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you look at it it is a crystallized white powder but from a distance it's
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going to look very very similar to the table salt that's in your salt shaker or the white granulated sugar that you
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might bake with or add to your coffee so when we think about the substance itself like the physical presence and
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appearance of it we have crystallized white powders all over our kitchen like
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why can't MSG be just as normalized and just as embraced for the flavor that it can give our food yes totally well
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that's a good segue so it does exist like in that powdery form and I'm guessing in that way we can you know put
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it in our dishes ourselves and we'll go over at the end today if it's cool with you car some like ways to use that
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practically if you are kind of new to that but tell us or tell our listeners rather like what types of foods tend to
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have MSG like what are the most popular foods that either naturally contain it or is it added to like in processing
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sure yeah let's start with the natural ones because I mean those are some of the favorites we're recording this right at the end of summertime and one of them
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is tomatoes I see them all over social media people are cooking with them but even when they're not in season as a
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fresh tomato you're going to find it in your tomato paste your tomato sauce you know anything that's made from that
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tomatoes are a really high source um of naturally occurring glutamate you'll also find it in mushrooms which is
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another favorite that's why in a lot of vegetarian or vegan or plant-based dishes that mushroom kind of serves as a
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meat substitute it's not just a textural thing right like it's also the savoriness kind of the mouth feel of it
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which is again coming from that glutamate and then anything that has um
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kind of that savory Umami flavor you can think of like a Parmesan cheese other age cheeses that kind of have that like
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little bit of funk to it you can't quite place it it's not exactly salty but it's
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not exactly you know bitter sour or sweet either it's really described you
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know if you trace back to the history of when it was originally identified and and isolated to be produced as an
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ingredient um they would call call it the essence of deliciousness which I just love because it is really kind of
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difficult to describe it without experiencing it firsthand like it's just
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a flavor enhancer whatever you're already tasting in your food it's going to make it taste that much more intense
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or that much better then when it comes to you know some of the foods that you'll find it added to a lot of people
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think immediately of Doritos that always comes up in my comments when someone is like oh you know don't you like Doritos
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don't you like some of these packet snack foods that have again like this very Savory component to them so those
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are some common ones but you know at this point really anything that has that glutamate component with either sodium
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added we can't really prevent those two from combining you know either as we're
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chewing once we're you know digesting all of that so I tell people you know
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this idea that it's found in only certain foods and others is kind of a misnomer because even when you're cooking from scratch at home and you
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have a high level of control over the individual ingredients you're using again it's all going to the same place
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so that glutamate is inevitably going to seek out that sodium pair up form that molecule to be then digested and broken
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down with the rest of our food I never thought about how it can get combined
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like during like the chewing process I like I feel like we think of like or we
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as in myself think of like oh way it's added how it's naturally like occurring in
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food um but like actually like when you're eating it like the combination of the Amo acid and like the sodium
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molecule I feel like that can be very easy to combine the two like in a lot of
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different dishes oh yeah and this is not at all exclusive to MSG either I mean we
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have our mechanical digestion which is the act of chewing right like mechanically breaking down our food into
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smaller and smaller pieces we swallow it it kind of gets churned around in our stomach that's that again
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mechanical digestion but then we also have chemical digestion so we have um
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lots of enzymes in our saliva those gastric acids that very acidic environment of the stomach and the GI
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tract you know those are also contributing to this breakdown of anything in our food whether it's a
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sodium molecule glutamate or another amino acid you know we have a lot of
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again relatively large and complex structures and there not all ready to just be absorbed in the small intestine
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and put straight to work like the body has to put a little effort in to do that so that's another way I kind of reassure
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folks that this is something that they can enjoy and use if they want to because it's no different than adding a
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spice or a seasoning or anything else to your food because again it's all going to the same place we at that point have
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no more control over keeping those individual molecules
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separated yeah it's going to the same place and your body will digest it just
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fine so I feel like we've kind of hinted at the like this next part a little bit
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but this will probably be one of the juiciest Parts because
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MSG I wouldn't say is Public Enemy Number One but it gets a lot of an necessary
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hate so what are some of the most common misconceptions about MSG
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that you feel passionate about debunking and then why does it get hate
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I knew this question was coming and you know if you're at all familiar with the topic this won't be any surprise but if you're new you might have only really
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heard of it in terms of being bad for you you know for lack of a better word people will call it a poison they'll say
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that it's toxic and it comes from a pretty you know chaotic history we'll
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say originally there wasn't that tension between you know the public perception of MSG and the actual ingredient but you
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know we fast forward to kind of a tumultuous time in American history and
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it started as a really xenophobic myth you'll hear it um this is now a very outdated and non-pc term but Chinese
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restaurant syndrome alluded to this idea that eating a meal at a Chinese
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restaurant you know ordering Chinese takeout eating those dishes that are part of the Chinese diaspora you know
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that would contribute to these unexplainable symptoms right like intense headaches you know grogginess
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feeling lethargic um mind fog you know it kind of runs the same script as what
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you hear a lot of the wellness influencers now kind of just alluding to these ambiguous symptoms this was maybe
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one of the earliest in instances of that happening um and it really sparked this
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you know public view of MSG as this thing that is bad for you and should be avoided
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and the really interesting intersection of that is obviously the racial and ethnic component so again this was in
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the 1960s I alluded to that a rather tumultuous time in American history and this xenophobic idea that you know
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Chinese food or East Asian food is so foreign so unfamiliar so you know just
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not part of the the standard diet that the typical American white American
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might be familiar with at that time and I think that was just like taking hold
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in people's mind and we see it trickling down through generations so if you think of someone who was old enough to kind of
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move through that logic at that time you know at this point they are grandparents
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so that belief whether it was overtly or explicitly said or not you know trickled
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down through their children and then their children's children and now it is just you know kind of part and parcel
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with this topic of foods that you should avoid um that general idea that MSG is
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this terrible thing and is strongly associated with Chinese or East Asian
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Cuisines is is here today and that's what we see a lot when when posts come up or whenever we're talking about it
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that's like the immediate thing that people jump to is Oh I thought it was bad for you and it's like like okay
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let's hash this out again that was my experience with it until honestly recently like I had only
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heard the negatives of it especially related to Chinese
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food and so it makes total sense to me that that is such a common misconception
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not that my lived experience is everybody's but I do feel like that is one that is just so misunderstood like
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you said right and I think it should be pointed out you know we haven't mentioned it yet but those so-called
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unexplainable symptoms really can be explained by the fact that they are not linked to MSG these have never really
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been replicated in a Welles designed and adequately powered clinical trial even
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anecdotally there's really interesting case studies where you know it's kind of like the placebo or nobo effect where by
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simply telling someone that MSG is in the food oh all of a sudden I feel like
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I'm experiencing a symptom or we didn't tell you MSG is in the food how are you
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feeling I think that's a really interesting way to kind of think about you know just that psychosomatic you
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know re action if you you know take any substance that could strike fear into
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you prior to eating it's like yeah that really does change your perception of how you physically and emotionally feel
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um but it should be stated that you know again when we have a well-designed methodology in a clinical trial
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something that is you know really designed to try to investigate that hypothesis and follow the scientific
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method that just has not been reproduced and those symptoms really are not linked
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to the consumption of MSG at a level that would be realistic out in the real world yeah yeah I feel like headaches
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migraines are definitely one that I hear a lot the other one I'm curious to ask you about is um being allergic to it so
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I hear a lot and I'm sure you do too care of my gosh is oh I can't have MSG because I'm allergic to it it causes
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like an allergic reaction what what's going on there when someone says that
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yeah well I first want to be really compassionate for anyone who does have food allergies or sensitivities of any
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kind I've said this before in a a video that I posted where you know this is frustrating it's expensive it is
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inconvenient like to have to live with a food allergy or a food sensitivity is
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not fun I think we would all agree that if we had the choice to avoid that discomfort and all the inconveniences
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like yeah I I really think most people would at the same time because we have
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this heightened awareness of allergies and sensitivities to food that's much more part of the common vernacular in
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the conversation than it used to be so because of that heightened awareness it's almost you know I don't want to you
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know kind of brush us off or sound like very Cavalier about it but it's a really easy way to avoid a line of questioning
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when somebody's like oh well why don't you want something don't you want to try this and you say no thank you I'm allergic or I can't because I'm allergic
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and I have a hunch you know again this is just my personal and professional opinion that because of that strong
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negative person ception of MSG and a desire to avoid it out of again a strong
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motivation to just take care of your body and treat It Well by saying I'm allergic to it again you you kind of
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have that PA of saying well that's my reasoning for avoiding something with MSG however at the same time it is
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really important to distinguish between a true allergen and something that may elicit symptoms because of a sensitivity
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or an intolerance so when we go back to that I a of an allergen that's going to be an immune mediated reaction to the
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presence of a specific protein so that you know could be your dairy allergy your egg allergy um soy allergies you
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know there's many many possibilities for allergies because of the proteins that
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are are found in Foods if we flip that over and you know go back to our MSG molecule if you remember earlier when we
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said it's just that single sodium attached to a glutamate well it's true that glutamate as an amino acid is a
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component of a protein structure we call them the building blocks of protein for a reason so many proteins you know it's
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the most common amino acid out there are going to have that glutamate molecule but that does not mean that the
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individual glutamate molecule found in MSG is going to bring forth that immune
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response like an allergy so that's a pretty you know pretty medicalized
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explanation and I think to the average person when it really comes comes down to it and they're experiencing a symptom
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it may appear the same whether it's a a sensitivity or an allergy and I really
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truly don't think it matters much at that point the reality and the truth of the matter is that they are experiencing
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something that they wish to avoid again it's uncomfortable can even be potentially life-threatening very very
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serious when it comes to allergens but the fact remains that there is no true
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MSG allergy again when we start getting into sensitivities and intolerances we also
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have to kind of question well what is it there is almost an infinite number of triggers for something like say a
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migraine and even for the same person in their same body those triggers may vary
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depending on environmental triggers or other stressors that you know they come into contact with so it just gets really
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really dicey to try to pinpoint the blame squarely on MSG alone when it may
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be a combination of factors are a different factor that elicit those symptoms what a I I appreciate that
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response very much I feel like you did a very good job of covering all
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aspects of it and we love also the medical side of it Hannah and I don't go too much
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into the biology and chemistry of nutrition super frequently so it was a
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fun a fun flashback yeah detour yeah
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cool well I feel like yeah I feel like I don't have
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anything to add about that besides potentially now that we've kind
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of talked about like what MSG is where it might appear discussing the reasonings for the
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misconceptions around it potentially and some also like just misconceptions
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about what it can cause in general if people are new to using MSG and or have never used it at all and
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they want to introduce into some of their home cooking how would you recommend they start like maybe I don't
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know if you have specific things in mind like different items in general when to add it anything like that absolutely I
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love answering this question I'd say it's probably the second most common question I get behind obviously is it
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safe or am I allergic that type of thing and I love anybody who wants to start
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using it or is unfamiliar because it's like I am about to just blow your mind your food is about to instantly start
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tasting so much better and again with a lot of other ingredients it can be really intimidating you think oh I need
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to precisely measure if I add it at the wrong time it's not going to work and
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the really great thing about cooking with MSG is you don't have to worry about any of that when it says in a
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recipe to add salt or when you're serving a dish a lot of recipes will say
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salt to taste you can literally exchange MSG for table salt in nearly a one for
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one exchange the difference is you know again MSG is pure Umami it's going to be
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that savory flavor it will have a level of saltiness with with added depth to
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flavor so if you're doing that exchange what you might miss out is like hey this feels somehow still a little bit salty
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but with a little something extra I do still want a little extra salt so I tell people you know you can always
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start by adding about half and then give it a taste see what you think you can always add more but if you're making
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something like a stir fry or a rice dish or a soup or a stew you know once it's
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in there you're not getting it back out so kind of go into it a little bit cautious taste along the way and um what
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I sometimes recommend to people who are brand new to it is like hey if you're going to go out and make this purchase
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it's not very expensive you may need to find it online or in an Asian grocer or
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market near you they usually will carry it in like a big just bulk bag near the
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spices and other seasonings and what I'll tell people to do is try a 50-50 blend so you know if you've got your
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salt shaker or a spice dish or you know the salt cell type thing if you just
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swap out half of the sodi or the table salt for MSG you're going to have a
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couple of benefits like obviously The Taste is really going to shift um but I alluded to that sodium piece because
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monosodium glutamate because it's lower in sodium than table salt you'll actually have a better way of
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controlling how much sodium ends up in the food you cook at home so I think when it comes from a you know Health
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perspective that's another thing that you know people aren't really considering it's like hey I'm used to this very salty flavor when I'm cooking
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with my food I might add salt before during or after cooking it's like you
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can do that exact same thing with MSG add it before during or after cooking
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and not only is that flavor going to be enhanced but you've also cut the sodium
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in that finished dish I just realized I've never really seen I don't think MSG
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like in a written recipe before so I really like go to my blog oh do you you
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put it in your recipes I'm sure you do I do yes I started doing that recently because while that was you know
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obviously how we've been cooking for a long time I said the same thing I was like okay if I go online and I'm looking
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for recipes you know there's a really great resource called no msg.com and you'll find more about you know the
24:29
science obviously the history things like that and they do have some recipes in their archives there but beyond that
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I mean we have content creators on YouTube and Tik Tok now who are very vocal and open about cooking with MSG
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but I agree I think it's still relatively rare to see like a written recipe that calls for that in the
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ingredient list so just in an effort to kind of normalize it and also be fully
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transparent and say this is how I made this recipe and testing and eating it myself you know putting MSG in there I
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think is is great and it's honestly whatever you're picturing an amount of MSG being it's probably less than that I
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don't know how this would Market at all this is not at all probably helpful to
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the listeners but I have a request Cara because I know you're very good at
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recipe development and your website is very pretty to look at I don't know this is this is on me for not knowing I don't
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know if you have a cookbook you have a cookbook okay you do I'm going I'm going to assume it's
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not what I'm thinking but I was going to say you should make an MSG fil or like
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MSG loving cookbook and it's just all different ways to incorporate MSG in different dis
25:47
dishes I feel like that would be so fun I I love that idea and I mean really a variety of recipes I mean again anything
25:54
that calls for salt I mean I've even seen instances where where chefs have used it in sweet recipes you know
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dessert recipes with ice cream um brownies it is fascinating because even
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to me that was a new use I tended to say you know use it for anything savory you
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know or grilled Meats roasted vegetables soups and stews sauces all the rest and
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then I started thinking about and I was like well there are instances of more Savory desserts there are desserts that
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you don't want to have overly sweet there's salted there's you know flaky sea salt on top
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of brownies and you know if you're open to experimenting with that I think it'd
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be great but no you're absolutely right my earlier cookbooks came at a time when you know my recipe development process
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looked quite different my whole branding and sort of online Persona looked really different so I would love to go back and
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redo it again if there are any you know cookbook editors and the a audience listening you know hook me up with your
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publisher because that is something I would I would love to do just again to normalize it and help people realize
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like the key to better home cooking or eating meals at home that you're genuinely excited about and want to eat
27:07
like it could be as simple as just adding like a Sprinkle of
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MSG I love that That's so exciting that that can go such a far
27:18
way yeah I feel like I'm gonna start doing that because I myself have never cooked with it so I'm like taking notes
27:25
like I'm so excited about this this is great yeah one last recommendation I can offer too it's behind me in the kitchen right
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now but we actually use it in a spice blend with other seasonings so again if you're not used to always salting your
27:38
food at the table or you just don't cook with a lot of table salt in general another way to you know experiment with
27:44
it is to think of like a salt-free seasoning blend you know it's going to maybe have granulated or you know
27:50
powdered garlic it might have onion flakes might have sesame seeds black pepper almost like a steak seasoning um
27:58
again you may even start with a store-bought steak seasoning get a salt-free one and then add maybe a
28:04
teaspoon or two or kind of adjust the ratios to whatever amount you're using and try it that way you know we put it
28:11
on top of like an herb sprinkle for salads or if we do like a frozen pizza
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at home um we love penes not all areas have a a spice store like that um but if
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you're using anything store-bought you know you can always Jazz it up a little bit at home and really make it your own
28:29
and the one that we use is called jet blend which is just a nickname that my partner had and so we're always saying
28:35
like where is Jets blend like it needs more Jets blend so that's how we use it a lot too oh that's a good idea I think
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it'd be really a really great idea once you especially figure out kind of the process of how much um but I'm sure also
28:51
too for the beginners it sounds like that can't even be helpful for them because you can kind of have other
28:56
things there to kind of Cook pushing it a little bit so it's not just straight MSG you're adding to your dishes where it is maybe a little too strong at first
29:02
if you're not used to knowing how much yeah I mean your taste buds are not going to steer you wrong because that's
29:08
another really beautiful thing about just mother nature and the whole biological design of things it's kind of
29:14
self-limiting and you know we're going to detect a level that is quote unquote too much so if you do accidentally get a
29:21
little heavy-handed with it give it a taste and realize wow I really can't taste much else at that point you know
29:28
you may be able to dilute it with some other things and you'll just know for next time kind of what that upper threshold is but when it comes back to
29:34
the safety piece of it you know there's no amount that we're going to realistically consume whether through
29:40
naturally occurring sources of of MSG or things that are added or in processed foods that are going to rise above a a
29:48
threshold of safety so again it's self-limiting in the sense that if you air into that territory of quote unquote
29:55
too much it's not going to taste good anymore it's going to be so unappetizing that you're probably not going to keep
30:02
eating that food that tastes unappetizing and when we compare that against some of the the cuisine Styles
30:08
and um areas that consume the most MSG you know our Japanese Cuisine or Korean
30:14
cuisine even in those very high consumption types of of Cuisines they're
30:19
not getting anything close to that like the average amount of of free glutamate or MSG that you're getting is again well
30:26
within the confines at the safety limit I I'm sure that applies to so many so many foods and ingredients and that just
30:33
goes back to the whole Wellness culture thing of oh it's toxic it's poisonous and you just cannot call a food or
30:39
ingredient that without saying the dosage there yeah yeah and I I have such a bone to pick too with you know again
30:45
going back to that list of foods where it's so naturally occurring so you know prominent in tomatoes mushrooms parmesan
30:52
cheese it's like let's think of some other Cuisines and ethnic groups that feature that really heavily in their
30:58
cooking and it's the Italy Italian cuisine Mediterranean diet and it it
31:05
again comes back to the really interesting and and often problematic intersection of the xenophobia and the
31:12
bias towards a very eurocentric or European style diet when that carries
31:18
over into what is now you know American Cuisine we tend to favor or view those
31:25
types of Cuisines more favorably not just for acceptance and familiarity but also you know when it comes to the
31:32
health accolades like the Mediterranean diet is one of the most heavily studied diets in the world there's a lot of
31:37
funding and you know a lot of interest in really validating that this is a healthy pattern of eating and like we
31:44
have right like it's almost common knowledge at this point that the Mediterranean style diet is a generally
31:50
healthy diet when it comes to well-being and long-term disease risk management all that great stuff yet at the same
31:57
time we can shift our Focus to other regions of the world and say yes it's different these are ingredients that are
32:04
less familiar to someone who's accustomed to that very eurocentric eating pattern doesn't mean that it's
32:09
worse and in some ways can be just as good or better yes a lot of I feel like
32:15
Mediterranean style foods are ones that are very eurocentric already like things
32:21
that people like me are already eating and so it does just feel a lot more familiar versus maybe more like Korean
32:29
type dishes or Japanese type dishes like you said they may have very similar
32:34
ingredients or like the MSG compound and certain things but because they're not
32:39
foods that we're eating on a regular basis it doesn't get all the glorification that the Mediterranean diet
32:45
does right so you know if you're listening to this and you know maybe hearing that for the first time it's not
32:51
to say that you're wrong or bad for harboring that same belief it's kind of like well until you know know better
32:57
there's really no difference like you're you're not able to really shift your your frame of mind around that until
33:03
you're exposed to something new but this is why I love talking about this topic so much because it is so common for me
33:10
to get a comment from somebody on a post or in a conversation that's like well I
33:15
didn't know that it was connected to this problematic racist myth or I didn't know that it was you know linked to
33:23
quote unquote Chinese restaurant syndrome and it's like well yeah this is why we're so vocal about it and being so
33:29
loud about the fact that we're trying to not only reverse and unwind decades old
33:35
myths about the ingredient but it's also standing up for Chinese restaurant
33:40
owners immigrant families who have started a small business in America you know it does become really personal
33:45
because I'm mixed race you know my Korean side of the family is going to be cooking with that traditional Korean
33:51
recipes are going to have very high Umami ingredients you know that's something that's really near and dear to
33:56
my my heart so to to see it framed in such a negative way it's like yeah there's the scientific side the
34:03
professional or medical side but in reality that myth is really most harmful
34:08
to those families to those you know restaurant owners the people who really cherish those Cuisine Styles um so it is
34:15
important to to speak to both pieces of it and at some point along the way you know a light bulb is going to go off in
34:21
the mind of someone who hasn't questioned it before and been like hm like I am maybe going to re think that
34:27
next time I regurgitate this myth that got passed down from my you know mom's
34:32
cousins in-laws whatever it's always like at least three degrees of separation and I'm like H let
34:39
me talk to them and we'll see how their symptoms really came up but you know I think that's again one of the things
34:45
that you know people don't really pause the question if you know it comes from a trusted Source or someone that's you
34:50
know an immediate family member someone you know who who you've always had you know reason to trust and believe it's
34:56
sort of like you maybe would not question it quite as extensively so having those conversations can sometimes
35:02
get a little bit heated you know especially on social media we don't always have the benefit of picking up
35:07
tone or intention but I find in face-to-face conversations especially that's where you can really kind of
35:14
unpack like what are your concerns like let's talk about them and like the last thing I'll say about it is at the end of
35:19
the day even with all of that new or different information and the reassurance that it is safe if someone
35:26
says they want to eat it or they still want to avoid it and not use it great no harm no foul the only thing I would ask
35:33
is next time you hear that myth you'll be armed with some of that information to push back against it yeah yeah that's
35:40
so true because like we're always we we're big Advocates of critical thinking
35:47
on the up digestions Podcast and like at the end of the day you can eat
35:54
whatever you want to eat you could you don't have to eat things you don't want to eat um
36:01
but what is driving a lot of the misconceptions around it is
36:06
really important that it is addressed um and it's perfectly fine to
36:11
say you don't want to eat it because you don't want to eat it but
36:18
kind of it's like why and having that conversation more is really important because it is it is so much it's like
36:24
such a a part of such a big bigger picture than just like
36:30
headaches and this biochemical makeup it's a lot
36:36
of like it's affecting races of people
36:42
and families businesses and it's very harmful and I feel like in Wellness
36:48
culture it's it's very easy for like them to just
36:53
Target I don't know if I want to say like just like making like pulling from
36:58
like some types of like how do I want to say this I don't know if I want I don't
37:04
know if misconceptions is the right word it's like maybe like preconceived notions about like
37:11
what you think and like what is normal and what's normalized especially in the
37:16
diet culture space and kind of weaponizing that to scare people about things oh
37:23
absolutely we've all seen those videos of a shortless guy in the grocery store
37:29
screaming about the ingredients in this processed food and I mean I think most
37:36
people can recognize that as being problematic in a number of ways yet at the same time it goes viral for a reason
37:44
right like those fear tactics and the emotional response that you know that drudges up in you we remember that a lot
37:51
more than data and Science and Pub Med links so you know we have to find a way
37:57
to kind of tell that story differently you know excitement is another emotion like if I can help you feel excited
38:03
about cooking at home or excited about really delicious food can that
38:09
potentially outweigh the fear or whatever like little seed has been planted in your mind by the guy without
38:15
a shirt screaming in the grocery store I love that though like using just
38:20
a different strong emotion for our marketing instead of fear because fear does sell but because it is a strong
38:27
emotion there are other emotions that we can we can use instead to promote more
38:32
evidence-based information hopefully right and you know Emily I'll go back to what you said earlier too
38:37
about you don't have to eat what you don't want to eat I will always stand behind somebody who says I just don't
38:44
like it and taste preferences you know we can't emphasize that enough like your taste preferences should be one of the
38:50
strongest drivers about what you do or don't eat I personally really really gravitate towards Savory Umami flavored
38:58
Foods that's probably very obvious at this point at the same time I have clients and you know different folks
39:05
that I know who will be like I have a major Sweet Tooth I love sweet flavors I love sour tart juicy flavors like yes we
39:13
have those five basic senses or tastes that our tongues can pick up on but when we think about the actual eating
39:19
experience our taste preferences go beyond just five basic flavors we can think about texture we can think about
39:26
temperature we can think about cooking method and preparation style and appearance and what it looks like on our
39:33
plate or in our bowl and all of those can be driven by obviously not just the
39:38
presence of a single ingredient like MSG but kind of the overall you know zoomed out experience of what that bite is
39:46
going to be and if somebody comes back and they're like I just don't like it great who might argue about what you
39:51
like or don't like again the only thing we would ask is let's not avoid it out of fear or misunderstanding I always
39:59
coach on you know being able to make really informed and empowered decisions so that you feel confident when you're
40:04
cooking or eating um and this really falls under that umbrella of just having enough information and experience with
40:11
something to decide for yourself whether it's for you or whether it's not and of
40:16
course too not spreading that Mis information to others whether it's your kids or Partners or on social media if
40:24
you are someone who talks about that on social media so not only making your own informed choices for feeding yourself
40:29
but if you are responsible for helping feed others not spreading that information on them
40:35
too and actually that's been one of the surprising things that's been happening lately is you know if I'm talking about
40:42
it online or in these digital spaces more often than not people are rising to the defense of MSG like they're
40:49
conversing amongst themselves in the comments and replying to one another or citing you know some of the data that's
40:55
out there um I'm sure you'll be able to link in the show notes if if anybody does want to access that but it's almost a
41:02
hands-off thing like sometimes I'll post and even just sort of wait and see and I would say that shift has hap happened
41:09
more recently you know in the past it was like oh brace yourself like the the trolls are about to come out and now
41:16
it's kind of nice like it's usually gonna pass the vibe check or at the very
41:21
least if one of those trolling comments does make its way in there there's somebody else
41:27
who you know may or may not know me personally or is familiar who's hopping in and saying like hey look this really
41:33
isn't backed up it is unscientific you can't be allergic to it it's not toxic and I love it I love it when that
41:40
happens that is like the most refreshing experience and it's kind of like if it is someone that you know is like a go-to
41:47
in your community it's like a mama bear moment almost like if you were the one who hopefully taught some great
41:52
information it's like oh I'm just so proud of you for being in my comment supporting me that's just so wonderful yes yes you've you've been
41:59
listening you heard what I said you remember it and now you're you're saying it yourself so yeah that does feel good
42:05
because I know there are a lot of people who are not nearly as chronically online as we are um and at the same time I know
42:12
there's a lot of people who are online a lot but don't necessarily engage like people will see posts they don't always
42:17
jump in and comment um but it is a nice sign that you know hey people are seeing it people are are listening are reading
42:25
um and I hope you know for this audience too if you're listening to this episode you know kind of rethinking too like
42:30
just staying skeptical like applying that critical thinking I am also a huge huge fan of critical thinking and just
42:37
like pausing like we're very quick to jump to assumptions especially with food like we all eat so we all have some
42:44
level of inherent body wisdom and experience and and all the the good stuff there but when we hear something
42:50
that's like that doesn't sound quite right you know just taking that pause and and thinking a little bit more
42:56
before we jump straight into you know reserving it in long-term memory or
43:02
perpetuating problematic myths cool well I feel like we did a very good job of
43:08
covering all things MSG um I'm sure there's more that can probably be said but go definitely check
43:16
out Cara's we're we're gonna allow you to Market yourself in a second but
43:24
definitely go check out Cara's content because there's a lot of good videos on there about MSG and resources do you
43:31
have any last any last thoughts you'd like to share before we wrap up this the only
43:39
thing that I will add is if you're going to be ordering online one of the things that my clients have loved just because
43:45
it makes cooking a little bit more fun is like you can get MSG just in a bulk bag or a giant canister but I have to
43:53
give a little shout out to my panda Shaker I feature that in a lot of videos and it never fails someone's like oh the
43:59
panda Shaker is there or like I got my own Panda Shaker so aoto is one of the
44:05
manufacturers of MSG and they do have like a little salt shaker it is more expensive I will admit to buy the MSG
44:12
that way but I will put a little plug in there and just say get one buy it once and then if you decide you like it just
44:19
keep refilling it that can be a really economical way to keep doing it because at my local Korean market I think I can
44:26
get a you know one pound bag which is a lot of MSG you know when you're using a
44:31
quarter of a teaspoon at a time a one pound bag is going to last you quite a
44:36
while you know something like that is only going to run a few bucks so in the big scheme of things when we're comparing it to other things that add
44:43
flavor um to our food to our meals um it really is relatively inexpensive and
44:49
again can just be you know that much more fun or delightful when you're in there and you are seasoning your food
44:55
and you can grab you know your cute little Panda Shaker I was hoping You' bring that up because it is just like the cutest thing
45:02
in the world and I actually need to get one myself it is so adorable I highly recommend it
45:09
yes um if you we'll make sure to link that in the show Notes too so you can also get your
45:16
own little painter maker because I'm feeling also very influenced right now I'm so influenced I we love cute things
45:25
so we're all about that cool well Cara o
45:30
no okay we're not done we're not done let if people want to hear more from you
45:35
where can they find you um we you already mentioned you also have a cookbook so they can buy your cookbook
45:43
feel free to share if anyone wants to hear more from you though where can they find you at I'm everywhere so all the
45:50
socials you know Instagram Tik Tok threads not so much Twitter and anym
45:56
Facebook Pinterest and then of course my blog is streetsmart nutrition.com that's where you're going to find you know
46:02
mostly recipes at this point but still a lot of topics and articles around intuitive eating and gentle nutrition
46:08
I'm also going to be Reviving a newsletter in 2024 so you can get in early to kind of catch you know that
46:15
growing email newsletter content form um and then one of the newest things that
46:21
I've been doing lately is YouTube so you know obviously a lot of you know just reusing the same videos in short form
46:28
but if you're interested in more nuance and in-depth conversations about some of these topics I really want to be doing
46:34
more of that on YouTube and connect with you there because again we just know that attention spans are so short I know
46:41
most people only have a tolerance for like a not even 10 second long video if you would like a 10 minute long video
46:48
come see me on YouTube it's awesome we definitely will link all those below and Cara thank you
46:54
again for coming back on we had a great time our first conversation even though I feel like we've really done a 180 we
47:00
went from like intuitive eating and Sports Nutrition to MSG you are just like a jack of all trades but our
47:07
listeners are going to love this so thank you again for coming on yeah thanks for having
47:12
me well tune in next week guys and if you want to listen to Cara's answer to
47:18
our bonus question you'll have to check out the beat Deets for this week otherwise we'll catch you next week bye
The Beet Deets Bonus Segment
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In this bonus episode, Emily and Hannah are joined by Cara Harbstreet and discuss: What is the Best Type of Tomato? The girls dive into TikTok trends, the tomato sandwich-side of summer foodtok, and which tomatoes they think are superior.
